Michael Moore to film sequel to Fahrenheit 9/11

on Nov 13, 2004

Michael Moore is just as likely to go away because of the Democratic loss of 2004 as Rush Limbaugh was after the Republican loss of 1996.

Entertainer-polemicists are, for better or worse, a major part of the the current political landscape. I really have no idea how many people they actually convert, nor how many true believers they motivate to vote, nor how many opponents they motivate to vote.

However, I do know one thing. Left wing America and right wing America have entirely different ideas of what the "truth" is at the moment, and neither side has any hope whatsoever of shutting up the "lies" from the other side, no matter how many ad hominem arguments are hurled, and no matter how many subpoints are debunked.

We all know that Moore and Kerry were inaccurate on some of the smaller points, but the liberals feel that their larger message is the correct one. We all know that Limbaugh and Bush were inaccurate on some of the smaller points, but the conservatives feel that their larger message is the correct one.

The voters have decided to go Bush's direction, but don't kid yourself into thinking that the other side will shut up and go away. If Ohio had gone for Kerry, do you think that Limbaugh and Savage would have gone away?

32

Angloesque

on Nov 13, 2004

I wasn't being sarcastic! I was being truthful.

Yeah, I know you weren't being sarcastic. I was.

*sigh again*

-A.

33

historyishere

on Nov 13, 2004

However, I do know one thing. Left wing America and right wing America have entirely different ideas of what the "truth" is at the moment, and neither side has any hope whatsoever of shutting up the "lies" from the other side, no matter how many ad hominem arguments are hurled, and no matter how many subpoints are debunked.

That seems like one of the arguments used to defend the adversarial legal system....

34

jeblackstar

on Nov 13, 2004

I was expecting that the democrats would begin moving in a different direction and reevaluate their tactics over the next 4 years.

Michael Moore does not speak for myself, any democrat I know, or the Democratic Party as a whole.

Cheers

35

historyishere

on Nov 13, 2004

Michael Moore does not speak for myself, any democrat I know, or the Democratic Party as a whole.

He doesn't speak for a lot of people... he just thinks he does.

36

Chemicalkinetics

on Nov 13, 2004

Well, perhaps another figure will emerge from the darkest wings of the Right to serve that purpose...

Nah. The Michael Moore factor is more than just Michael Moore himself. It is the fact that many Democrat establishment actually embrace Michael Moore. Many Democrat politicans attended Moore's Fahrenheit 9/11 premier. Daschle allegedly delayed his Senate vote to attend this film. Remember, Moore was invited to the Democratic National Convention to sit next to President Jimmy Carter (not everyone get to sit next to Carter, you know). The Democrat endorsed and promoted Mr. Moore. So, for all democrats out there who believed the Democratic Party has nothing to do with Moore, think again.

The missing factor is not the Right lacks extreme liars, rather the repubican establishment do not embraces and endorses those extremists.

37

historyishere

on Nov 13, 2004

The missing factor is not the Right lacks extreme liars, rather the repubican establishment do not embraces and endorses those extremists.

Good point. Then again, if someone like that was on the Right (people like Coulter/Limbaugh), where helping their cause, the Republican leadership would just let them do they do without giving explicit praise or openly embracing these people, but they would still allow that damage to be done from a comfortable distance.

38

jeblackstar

on Nov 13, 2004

Nah. The Michael Moore factor is more than just Michael Moore himself. It is the fact that many Democrat establishment actually embrace Michael Moore. Many Democrat politicans attended Moore's Fahrenheit 9/11 premier. Daschle allegedly delayed his Senate vote to attend this film. Remember, Moore was invited to the Democratic National Convention to sit next to President Jimmy Carter (not everyone get to sit next to Carter, you know). The Democrat endorsed and promoted Mr. Moore. So, for all democrats out there who believed the Democratic Party has nothing to do with Moore, think again.

The missing factor is not the Right lacks extreme liars, rather the repubican establishment do not embraces and endorses those extremists.

I'm sorry, but everything in your post, with the exception of Michael Moore being at the convention, I do not agree with, nor do I believe your assertions. I would ask that you cite something saying Daschle delayed his floor vote, I would ask for a cite saying that "many democrat politicians" attended the premier, with their names. I would also point out that Ann Coulter is just as "mean" as Moore is, if not more so, and she's accepted and embraced by "the republican establishment", probably in much the same way that Michael Moore is embraced by the democrats.

39

Chemicalkinetics

on Nov 13, 2004

Michael Moore does not speak for myself, any democrat I know, or the Democratic Party as a whole

Really?

Than why did the Democratic Party embraced and promote Moore? Why did Democratic politians used Moore's "facts" to discredit the president? Why did a large numbers of Democratic senators and respresentives attened Moore's Fahrenheit 9/11 preimer in Washington? Why was Mr. Moore invited to this year Democratic National Convention and sat next to President Jimmy Carter? Do you really think Moore was a lonely man in the captial hill? Moore was in fact embraced as hero by Democratic establishment before Nov 2nd. Go dig up the old news if your memory faded.

40

jeblackstar

on Nov 13, 2004

Really? Than why did the Democratic Party embraced and promote Moore? Why did Democratic politians used Moore's "facts" to discredit the president? Why did a large numbers of Democratic senators and respresentives attened Moore's Fahrenheit 9/11 preimer in Washington? Why was Mr. Moore invited to this year Democratic National Convention and sat next to President Jimmy Carter? Do you really think Moore was a lonely man in the captial hill? Moore was in fact embraced as hero by Democratic establishment before Nov 2nd. Go dig up the old news if your memory faded.

I've already said I don't believe those statements. If Democrat politicians used Michael Moore's facts, couldn't it be more likely to say that Moore used their facts? Further, what facts are you referring to? I'm not wasting my time digging through 3 years of CNN.com pages or New York Times articles because you want to make false connections between Democrats and Moore.

41

Chemicalkinetics

on Nov 13, 2004

I'm sorry, but everything in your post, with the exception of Michael Moore being at the convention, I do not agree with, nor do I believe your assertions. I would ask that you cite something saying Daschle delayed his floor vote, I would ask for a cite saying that "many democrat politicians" attended the premier, with their names. I would also point out that Ann Coulter is just as "mean" as Moore is, if not more so, and she's accepted and embraced by "the republican establishment", probably in much the same way that Michael Moore is embraced by the democrats.

The truth is out there. If you were listening before, you would know. If you missed your chance, and want to find out, you can do it on your own. Dude, it is not my fault if you are too lazy to read

42

jeblackstar

on Nov 13, 2004

If I was listening before? Isn't that the kind of statement made by Kooks who think that the Black Helicopters are coming for us? I mean seriously, I've asked you for proof, if you give me dates and places where it was written down, by a credible source, I'll go find it myself. Instead, you've done none of that, you've made insulting generalizations.

Cheers

43

Chemicalkinetics

on Nov 13, 2004

I do not mean to insult you. Sorry. It is just that when you say you don't want to waste time to find the source. It implies that your time is more valueable than mine. Doesn't it? Anyway, I will porivde you a source now from CBS news:

"But last night the city's political heavyweights -- well, the Democratic ones, at least -- greeted Moore with open arms as they turned out en masse for the Washington premiere of his new film Fahrenheit 9/11. Packing the Uptown Theater to the rafters, about 800 people -- including South Dakota Senator Tom Daschle, Florida Senator Bob Graham, and Democratic National Committee Chairman Terry McAuliffe, to name just a few of the prominent Democrats in attendance -- took in Moore's two-plus hours of Bush-bashing, applauding throughout and giving Moore a standing ovation when it was over. Even Moore seemed a bit taken aback by the Democratic establishment's effusive embrace. "

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2004/06/24/opinion/main625985.shtml

CBS is a relatively credible source -- well, at least it is a major news.

44

jeblackstar

on Nov 13, 2004

::laughs::

I'm sorry, but I didn't think I would hear a republican say that CBS was credible after the Rather incident. Anyway, yes, in a manner of speaking, my time is more valuable than yours in this case. You've got the cite, however you found it, and are hoarding it, and I wouldn't even know where to start looking for it. As for the three individuals you mentioned, Daschle got beaten, Graham retired, and I have a feeling that Terry McAuliffe will be looking for a job in the near future. As for the rest of it, the Democratic Party as a whole is not our leadership, it is not our senators, and it is not our congressmen. It is the millions of Americans who are registered in the party. Do the politicians in the party latch themselves on to people who they think will motivate their base? Yes, but the ironic thing is, that a majority of the Democrats, while agreeing with the major premise of Moore's, i.e. Bush=Bad, were turned off and repulsed by F 9/11. My previous statement is correct, parts of your statement are correct as well, but they were phrased so as to be misleading. Democrats, in general, do not Support Moore. And even if we had in the past, we were pretty offended by a lot of things Moore has done.

Cheers

45

Chemicalkinetics

on Nov 13, 2004

Anyway, yes, in a manner of speaking, my time is more valuable than yours in this case. You've got the cite, however you found it, and are hoarding it, and I wouldn't even know where to start looking for it.

Actually when the Democratic establishment atteneded Moore's Fahrenheit 9/11 preimere (sometime Jan/Feb), the event made it on national papers and TV news, as well as some night time TV journals (maybe 60 minutes or Nightline). I didn't just dig this information up. I knew about this information from my recollection. In short, I have to do a internet search to find a providable source. I thought you could find it faster than me. Yeah, I had to find a liberal news source for you. I found two other source, like Washington Post and FOXNews, and I had the feeling that you would say they are not credible. So I had to go for CBS (relatively liberal) news. Yeah, you can tell I didn't want to describe CBS as credible. I said it is "relatively crediable -- well, at least it is a major news (source)". Ha ha ha

Well, now you are disengaging your own Democratic Party by saying the senators and respresentatives do not represent the average Democrats. Forget about how the average joe Democrats think because there wadn't a national poll on them, and neither you or me can really know how they think of Fahrenheit 9/11 -- although many people attend the film. From my own circle, my Democratic friendsall like Fahrenheit 9/11. At the end, it is certain thatthe "Democratic Establishment" has embraced Moore in the last year.